Everyone knows a biker friend that has been knocked over while driving their ridiculously over-powered Motorbike at some stage or other. The thing is, why wouldn’t you want to drive a bike? It’s fuel efficient, exhilarating and more importantly you can get to your destination quicker. We’re told by the people at bike safety foundations such as “Think Bike” that we should be careful and courteous to our Bike driving compatriots on the road as in an accident they are more likely to be injured than you in your big scary car. I say to bikers: “when you learn how to drive we’ll stop running you over”.
Now before you think I’m trying to tell everyone to run over every member of the Hell’s Angels lets take a step back and see why I think that bikers are a hypocritical nuisance.
Lets take a look at the average bike rider: most of the time they don’t stay in a lane and tend to straddle the middle of two lanes. Now bear in mind they never stick to the left hand side of the road like bicycle drivers do. Oh no, the motor-biker needs to make his presence known by zipping in-between two lanes (usually with cars in both lanes) to show his dominance in the petrol engine world. This fact is ever more pronounced when it comes to the highway, especially in traffic. You see, the biker feels that they do not have to suffer in traffic and zips between lanes (not in lanes, between) so that they can get to the bar faster than everyone else. Now lets see what the issue is here…. oh that’s right: you’re sitting in car drivers blindspots where they cannot see you and then you are shocked when they pull out to take the empty space in the lane next to them! It comes as a shocker why bikers get knocked over in traffic when you put it like that right? Here’s the simplest way I can put it: I stay in a lane, why can bikers not? If you think back to your drivers license test, one of the things that sticks out is the piece of advice that say “don’t overtake from the left”. Think about that one bikers.
The second issue is why bikers feel the need to drive at warp-speed all the time? I get the fact that your bike can accelerate from 0-100 in less than three seconds but here’s an important truth: When you’re going at 140Km/h it takes a long time to stop let alone slow down. In this time you’re most likely careening over the taxi that jumped the light. Here’s another thing most bike drivers don’t seem to know: the speed-limit is 60 Km/h in most areas and 120Km/h on most highways. In my car, I have to stick to these rules so why do bike owners feel the need to speed consistently. Lets be honest, people drive shockingly and instead of relying on cars to stop when you’ve just hit warp factor 9, slow dooooooooown.
Now of course I’m generalising here but I feel I’m touching on a point most other drivers get angry about as well. The simple fact is that bike owners are their own worst enemies with their inability to pick a lane, drive at a reasonable speed and the need to weave between cars no matter how much or how little traffic there is. I’ll “Think Bike” the moment you stop driving like an idiot.
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Perfect example of ignorant bigotry practiced by self serving arrogance
So, until all bikers behave themselves you’re prepared to ignored a two-pronged safety campaign, the second prong being the one aimed at teaching bikers how to behave well on the roads?
I’m not really convinced of the validity of your argument. Think Bike is doing a lot to improve bike safety, and not just by making motorists aware of bikes, but by making bikers aware of the risks. Dismissing their efforts won’t help save lives.
(Disclaimer: I also ride, and I’m a Think Bike member.)
Hi. It’s clear bikers have pee’d you off big time, but as I biker (who sometimes will pee you off regardless of what I do), I ask you to ThinkBike anyway. See it this way. Regardless how reckless or stupid (in your opinion) I ride, do I deserve the death penalty and should you be the executioner?
Save driving and I hope you will look around you and see that, just like some motorists are dangerous and some are not, and some rugby players are buffoons and some are not, some bikers are actually good, safe riders.
Share the road with me.
To the author of this article.
Thanks for the update. I am a motorcyclist that commute everyday between Pta and Jhb.
First I want to mention that Think Bike as an organization is doing tremendous work to ensure that bikers are seen and also promoting bikers to adhere to speed limits, law etc. I myself am a proud member of think Bike, and will always be.
It is not illegal for a bike to lane-split, and if you can have a look at the booklet of your learners license, you will see that “it is safe for a vehicle (read bike) to pass on the left/right hand side of another vehicle when the road is wide enough to permit this maneuver”. Thus, more justifying my point that lanesplitting is not illegal.
However, it is a priviledge to lanesplit. yes, even we as bikers see these morons with a death wish that screams by at 100km/h while traffic is stationary. I,even as a biker, get very mad and sad when I see these reckless people. I, for one, ride a superbike, with full legal numberplate, within the speed limit.When I laneslit, I usually split only10-20km/hr faster than the cars around me, so that I can react if a car wants to turn infront of me. I wave and nod when a driver has made a space for me. I try to bring the concept of Think bike (raising awareness, saving lifes) to other bikers as well. We do not target just people in cars, we are actively talking to the biker community.
How many times has a biker waved/nodded at you when you made a space for him to pass you while you sit in traffic? Honesty please?
Bikers are also only human, and we are also just looking to get back safe to our loved ones.
I am more than willing to meet with you or to debate with you.
Kindest regards
Let me think about your statments… I do not agree in most cases. I ama biker and commute daily. with sitting higher than the average car driver you will be surprised to see what is happening behind those steering wheels.
1. Reading a nice book or newspaper is in the order of the day.
2. doing makeup (obviously moving the mirror so you can see your own face)
3. shaving
4. cellphones
What gets to us bikers is not people changing lanes. It is the idiots that do not use their mirrors or indicators. Those deliberately moving out in front of you. (Yes we can see it as your eyes and face reflects in your mirror)
so feel free to “run me over” I will feel free to defend myself from your attempted murder with due justice.
I await your reply
I ride a bike and keep in my lane but its twats like u that come over & push into my lane forcing me to move over to where ever i can.You where probably sitting on the toilet playing & thinking about what cr?p u can write about today.WAKE UP.Even if we ride in a lane u ars,-?!les still push in next to us.U r obviously a very bored, ignorant little man with nothing better to do, than try to show off on a forum & probably drive a bmw or merc.Shame !!!
First of all …… i don’t know how to drive a motorbike or bicycle…. I ride my motorbike….
Secondly ….Lane splitting is legal in SA. why do you think i commute on my Motorbike ? I commute to save time and so something that i have a passion for..
I dont believe in doing warp speeds threw traffic and neither will the Think Bike campaign preach it, so i do understand some of the car DRIVERS frustrations.
BUT car drivers change lanes without looking and thats where the problem starts…. 90% they say i have not see the bike ….. BS they have not looked.
Fair point.
I don’t drink, and hence have no bar to get to. It’s my kids i go to, actually.
And frankly, if you wish to waste your life away parked on some obscure piece of tar, between here and there, at least you could do us all the favour of staying awake and alert for the journey.
I have better things to do. Next time in traffic, spend some time counting the wasted man hours, wasted energy, and wasted thoughts and efforts. And when you demand that i sit with you in traffic, i’ll give you the finger and carry on to my destination.
It’s not really about Think Bike, it’s about THINK … fullstop.
Hi
With regards to your post about bikers I applaud you as it shows the mentality of certain cage drivers, I can guess that you are one of the cage drivers who constantly uses a mobile phone without a hands free kit, I can further assume from your post that you have an inferiority complex as you are one of the Cage Drivers who thinks that as you use a flashy cage that you are in a class of your own. I would not be at all surprised if you are one of the few that have purchased the Licence for your cage instead of sitting down and writing the examination like the rest of us.
From your post I must say that to sum it up, I HAVE NEVER SEEN SOMEONE MORE IN DESIRE OF A MOTORCYCLE LICENCE (Legally Written) AND THE USE OF A MOTORCYCLE THAN YOURSELF.
To further alleviate your problem, I suggest that you contact your nearest licence offices and make a booking for a Learners Licence for a motorcycle, after writing the examination and passing it, than you go to a motorcycle dealer and go and purchase a motorcycle and once this is done contact any motorcycle rider school and you will see that your stress levels will reduce as congestion is a problem and Lane splitting on a motorcycle (when done sensibly) is legal as it reduces the congestion.
Motorcycles may not stand or ride two abreast so without lane splitting the traffic will be endless, also motorcycles require the air to cool the engine down
On second thought I would rather not do the above as it might aggravate you more that there will be Road Rage due to the fact that on a motorcycle you will see the ignorance and stupidity of certain cage drivers.
Rather stick to your cage
As a cage driver and a biker I feel I can share some valuable information with you. Firstly lane splitting is legal for bikers due to their size as long as it is done safely. When on a bike so many conditions are’nt as favourable as when driving a car hence you see most bike accidents end up with the biker being seriously injured. I like the fact that you admit that this is a general comment. I have been a biker for just over a year felt your sentiments and though alike but after joining think bike started to see things differently.Making way for bikers to lane split is all about courtesy, I must admit though that there are those that make us look bad.I would further suggest for you to join the forum @think bike and maybe you may change your mind.
While much of what is said above has a lot of substance please allow me to correct a few points.
1) Think bike is an awareness campaign aimed at both car drivers and bikers. Think bike advocated respect and responsability from both parties.
2)Think Bike is not an enforcement agency, that is the job of metro, irresponsable behavior should be refered to them, (Chap dressed in blue and khaki, usually found behind a bush).
3) Lane splitting is allowed in SA law, albeit not at excessive speeds.
4) I can also generalise about car drivers (I am one of them) and how they try kill us at every opportunity even when we are riding responsably and within the law.
5) If you can offer constructive criticism then join up with Think Bike and help them make a difference.
Not all bike riders are irresponsable, just as all drivers are not going to drive over bikes.
You can find me on the Think Bike forum, under the nickname ta2bryan, at http://www.tbforum.co.za if you want more insight into the campaign
Kind regards
Bryan
P.S this is not an official Think Bike response, but my personal view
Please post this comment and as i’m sure people who enjoy your blog would enjoy a view from the other side. I’m sure that this vent you’ve done will double your readers and people listening to your pod cast. I’m sure you’ve had a few very aggressive replies to your blog but i will attempt to keep mine civil
. You take on the organization, “Think Bike” and by doing so have stirred up a hornets nest. These are passionate people who give of their spare time and money to help try and attempt to make things more bearable from the other side of motoring. Not only by trying to make motorists more aware of bikes but to try and educated the average, rossi-wannabe, biker to be more cautious and curtious on the roads. They really are doing amazing work and what you see is not all that they do to make the roads safer and better for all of us. We as bikers are fully aware of the people you generalize about and we ourselves shake our heads at them so you’re not alone there. On the subject of “lane-splitting”, it is legal and in fact encouraged by law enforcement and the likes to reduce road congestion which you derive pleasure from, referring to your “i love jozi” blog, but others do not share your joy in… This is another thing that makes our Gauteng beautiful, the diversity. Just remember that it’s not scum who rides bikes these days, it’s mostly people with money as it costs alot more to buy a nice big powerful motorcycle than it did 10 or 15 years ago. The people you are slatting could turn out to be say your doctor, dentist or lawyer. People you need. Traffic is frustrating to most and so therefore an alternate form and means is turned to. It takes absolutely no effort to be a little more cautious on the road in this fast paced society and by doing so you could avoid an incident and save someone elses life. If each person did that then we would have safer roads. So the next time you want to jump into that space, just check the blind spot, which by the way they do also teach you to do in driving school, and we will greatly appreciate it. Move a little to the right when we come by and i guarantee 90% of bikers will wave a thank you to you for it… Which will cause him/her to smile and yourself for doing a good deed in our cut throat society. It becomes infectious and soon we will all start to get along. Come on over to http://www.thinkbike.co.za, create an account on the forum and make some new friends and you’ll start to see we’re not all that bad. It’s like those people you refer to that drive too slow or too fast, we have those too. There’s a few bad apples no matter where you go, so let’s not generalize or i could put all drivers including all bad taxi’s into the same generalization. Have a great day! James
Uhm, yeah, well, as a biker, please check out my response here:
7 Points In Defense Of The Biker
I suppose I would fit the category of “hypocritical nuisance”. NOT! Actually, I pay my taxes like other people in their ‘big scary cars’. That entitles me to ride a motorcycle on the road. Believe it or not, it also entitles me to get home to my wife and two kids, aged 12 and 10. All three of them worry about me when I share the road with YOU, dude, and taxi drivers, car drivers, bus drivers, and truck drivers who think your main purpose in life is to “teach me a lesson” on the roads. You do realise that very recently, a taxi driver also allegedly believed he would teach 17-year-old scooter rider, Sheldeen Human, a lesson on her scooter. Oh, she was NOT going to the pub but to school. Like you, I was at work and couldn’t attend her funeral.
Next up, imagine what would happen if every bus and truck driver believed his role on the roads was to teach car drivers like yourself, a lesson? Yup, there’s always someone bigger than your car around.
I actually find blogs like yours extremely irritating – if only for the gross generalisations inherent in it. Every day, someone in a car kills another human being on a motorcycle, “to teach them lessons”, out of ignorance, stupidity, to take that cell phone call…
or simply because “I didn’t see you…”
You’ve got it wrong, Sir, Think Bike is not a campaign to excuse poor riding. It exists to help me get home alive. Plain and simple like that.
We’re human, and we recognise that everyone makes mistakes. True, a “mistake” in a car can mean the death of a biker, but it is a risk we are willing to accept. Truth is, I ride at 90 in a 60 zone TO GET AWAY FROM DRIVERS LIKE YOU! Think about that one!
The question is, how do my kids feel about me sharing the road with the likes of you? Tens of thousands of you. If I were to lower myself to your level of “thinking” then I and other ThinkBikers could easily go around kicking off your mirrors, etc when you do something stupid on the road that puts my life at risk, er.. to teach Mr. Car Driver a lesson? How immature would that be? Precisely how I feel about your logic!
Most of us bikers are better human beings than that, even whilst car drivers are trying to teach us lessons they think we need.
You don’t seem to realise a simple fact of physics as you sit behind your steering wheel. A bike ’steers’ by weaving. SO what you perceive to be reckless riding is actually how a motorcycle steers. It doens’t seem like you have ever put yourself behind handle bars before making brash generalisations.
I ahve no doubt that some biker annoyed you recently. Does it help for me to say, each time I put my bike on the road 10 car drivers try to prise my life away?
Therefore, does it really help for your to sit behind a smug cage of metal and point fingers?
Sorry, dude, your post is totally one-sided, arrogant, mis-directed, and it says more about you than about my riding.
Have you ever considered that whilst you sit in your air conditioned luxury sedan and especially in the event of it raining that we,re getting sopping wet not only by god himself peeing down on us but by your wheels throwing up so much spray we can barely see! Hang on a second,”why did that biker just overtake me on the left” is possibly due to the fact you drive whilst chatting or smsing away on your cellphone merrily swaying from left to right leaving the poor biker wondering “is this guy changing lanes without indicating,which lane is he going to he cant decide” Easiest option being take the gap and get past you to carry on chatting,doing your makeup,shaving,stirring coffee,chuckling at some sarcastic lack of wit by some over-paid DJ…this list just carries on and on. The reason we do excessive speeds is to generally leave people like you in your golf 5,s,bmw,s 4×4,s which never see actual off road terrain from trying to race us and sit on our asses! i can guarentee you that YOU,yes YOU speed and do not stick to speed limits! The fact is bikers lane splitting isnt the problem(if it was i wouldnt see metro police on cop bikes doing it) The problem lies in your insufficient use of your vehicles mirrors,your negligence at other rules of the road and the funny thing is(i want you to think about this carefully now) HOW MANY BIKERS DO YOU SEE SKIPPING ROBOTS?????? thats funny and quite a contradiction that we do warp speeds yet somehow we manage to stop? The reason is WE,RE TO SCARED TO JUMP A ROBOT BECAUSE WE KNOW A STUPID CAGE DRIVER JUMPS THEM ON A DAILY BASIS!!!!
So next time you see a bike headlight in your mirror take a look at yourself and put down that cell phone,stop stuffing your over weight face with that steers burger and try use those indicators once in awhile,they not their to make the car decorative for xmas!
Im a biker, a car user, and a road captain for a bike club in Durban. Firstly, i would like to say, BIKES ARE NOT THE ONLY DANGEROUS DRIVERS ON THE ROAD!!!
I speak from personal experience when i say, when i accelerate, or lane split, most time i do it to get away from drivers who have no regard for motorcyclists. I face being taken out daily by idiots on the road who do not see me, or who drive so close to my rear wheel, any kind of stop would lead to my demise! This is the main reason some bikes ride a little faster than you cagers.
You dont see bikers while putting on make up, or talking on a cell phone on the way to work. This is against the law, just like speeding, but you still do it!
Lane splitting, and riding through traffic is NOT against the law, beleive it or not. Can you imagine if every biker waited behind cars….can you imagine how much longer you would have to wait at robots? can you imagine how much more traffic there would be? We greatly appreciate the gaps some motorists give us, its the ignorant drivers like you we try stay away from.
Not all bikers speed, not all bikers are reckless. You taking a generalization, and sticking it to all the bikers out there!
As far as Think Bike is concerned, Think Bike is a safety initiative, and they they helped many a biker, as well as people, and charities in need. So my advice to you, think before you shoot your mouth off about things you dont know about!
Get a bike, ride it for a month, and witness the risks we face on a daily basis, THEN, you can come here and insult us bikers, and say how reckless we are.
Your punch line “you will think bike when we stop riding like idiots” is the most pathetic thing i have ever heard. Just remember, we have families JUST like you, some of us with a wife and kids to get home to. And if you ever take one of us out, i hope this sits on your conscience until the day you too are laid to rest
Dude, don’t knock it just because you don’t know how to ride a bike. I know you smaak Fedora hats more than – lets say helmets – but riding a bike takes much more precision and skill than driving a car. Go get on a bike and take a ride on the N1, then come back and bash all you want. Or don’t, and next post about something else you don’t know anything about, like how gay it is playing the piano.
I feel your pain because yes there is allot of bikers out there that rides like idiots
However lane splitting for motorcycles is 100% legal in South Africa.
What you are promoting is killing people because they are doing something that is 100% legal
I’m not talking about the genius who is riding 140KPH between cars doing 30
I’m talking about the 16 year old kid legally passing a car in the same lane.
If I were to say to you that I don’t like the fact that cars are allowed on the road and because of that I’m going to take a gun and kill all of them you would think I’m nuts
Why because cars are allowed on the road and anyone who wants to kill them for being there must be insane
Car drivers who says “ja well I will just run you over because I don’t like the fact that you don’t pick a lane“ is actually promoting murder.
So to me they sound like someone who is nuts
So I truly hope that no one you know or care about gets killed by a car driver with your murderous attitude
Oh and lastly please go and read up a bit “think bike” is trying to promote better riding for both cars and bikes.
They don’t target cars they also try and get some of the hooligan bikers to ride safer.
Maybe you can learn something there
Dude, catch a wake numb nuts and go read the laws on what is legal and ain’t on the roads when it comes to biking before trying to discredit valid organizations such as think bike. Lane splitting is legal for bikes. We do not speed, that’s why there is track days. Stop generalizing like a schmuck and wake F up. Cagers like you should stop thinking about themselves the whole time and consider the other people on the road, cagers and bikers alike. WAKE UP when you drive and check your blind spots when changing lanes, indicate BEFORE you turn, not during and next time you see a biker, make some space for him to slide by, you will be surprised at how nice a response you’ll get for being courteous towards bikers instead of flaming them like the uninformed judgmental d1ck you obviously are. Oh, and do me a one more favor, if you do travel the N1 daily, please try and do something stupid to me if I come lane splitting past you so I have an excuse to pull you over and beat some sense into you. Pretty please…with lots of sugar on top.
What you are refering to is lane splitting, which is totally legal. The reason i commute on my bike is for this exact reason. I dont want to sit in traffic going at the speed of the slowest individual in traffic, i would rather spend time with my family.
Fully agreed that many bikers ride like hooligans. But lane splitting is helping you in the long run, all those guys on bikes would have to leave home earlier and you would be that number of cars further back in the traffic every morning.
Yesterday i had a close call while lane splitting, the driver suddenly swerved , all that we ask is that you at least observe, and at the very least indicate.
Evidently you drive on a different planet. When last did you see anyone in this country travelling the speed limit. I have had more close calls by going the same speed as car drivers who refuse to check blind spots before changing lanes than actually going faster than them. Secondly lane splitting and filtering is legal in this country. Oh and as for overtaking on the left, it is legal on multilane roads. Perhaps you should go out and purchase a copy of “How to pass your learners license easily” as it is apparent you need a recap. You will notice that before you can change lanes you need to: Check mirrors, check blind spot, indicate, check blind spot and mirrors again and then move. As opposed to what everyone does which is indicate and take the gap to the left. Wake up you idiot
Hey guys. I do approve of the Think Bike campaign and what it is doing. However, as can be seen by the comments: bikers make a lot of noise but certainly don’t always stick to the rules themselves. The simple fact of the matter is that bikers should be more perfect than perfect when it comes to sticking to the rules of the road not only for safety but for the fact that they make so much noise as well.
Here’s the thing, 99% of drivers out there are idiots and you need to be safe. My issue is that despite so much good work done by campaigns like Think Bike there are a large amount of bikers that ruin your name.
Keep up the good work guys and stay safe, those luxury sedan drivers are morons. Just remember, bikers can be irresponsible as well, you’re not always perfect.
Ok, so some of my best mates are bikers…and they’re a pretty responsible bunch.
So I don’t see what the problem is. The insane and reckless bikers (and drivers, but mostly bikers) will eventually exterminate themselves through their own actions (sadly there will be collateral casualties, but you can’t make an omelette without breaking a few eggs).
I am of course referring to guys like “ThinkBike Supporter” above and his pearls of wisdom: “Oh, and do me a one more favor, if you do travel the N1 daily, please try and do something stupid to me if I come lane splitting past you so I have an excuse to pull you over and beat some sense into you.”
That kind of attitude helps no-one. But that said, basic physics dictates that in a collision between a car and a bike, the owner of the former will probably be able to visit his kids the following week. So, Think Bike Supporter, I hope your medical aid is paid up mate…
Anyway, the actions of folks like Think Bike Supporter and his ilk are representative of classic Darwinism in action: creatures that put themselves in harm’s way each day, minimise their chances of getting away with it each time they do.
Let’s hear it for the responsible cagers and bikers out there.
Wow. It’s called “perspective”, people.
The fact remains that if you break traffic flow, legal or not, you’re setting yourself up for an accident.
Getting all hissy at someone for pointing that out says volumes about everything else.
~ Wogan
I couldn’t agree more. People on bikes have a death wish. Everyone I know who’s a biker has been in accidents, some of them quite serious. Both my father and a friend of mine died in bike accidents.Other friends have broken bones and backs. People on bikes ride like they own the road. Your self-righteousness is not going to spare your life – at least in a car you have a fighting chance of surviving, on a bike there’s nothing to protect you (especially not your flimsy little helmet). Stick to the rules of the road and perhaps you’ll make it another day.
I have been driving cars for 13 years and know very well what it is like in traffic. I have seen the the bikes doing crazy speeds through traffic, I still do! After learning to ride I have realised how ignorant we ALL are in our cars. I would suggest that everyone should go take a novice riding course, you will be surprised at what you are missing. Until 8 months I had never even sat on a bike and ever since I choose to commute 100km’s a day.
A few things I have picked up on since I have started riding (just so you can think about them).
- Many of the things bikes do that people in cars regard as reckless or inconciderate, are done in defence to get out of or avoid a dangerous situation ( speeding ahead of traffic at lights, accelerating hard past an individual car and then breaking before the next car, Weaving in a lane in front of or behind another car ect..)
- Bikers are much more aware of their surroundings than the guys in cars.
-I didnt think that talking on cell phones in cars was such a big problem. You guys have no idea how many people really talk on their phones while driving! I have seen many people doing this in cars that i know have bluetooth hands free as standard! I have even seen someone texting on two phones at once!
- NOBODY does K53. Very few people look into their blind spot. Many dont even use the side mirrors.
-Most cars indicate while moving instead of using them to show that they wish to move.
As a motorist that enjoys driving as much as riding I must say … in my opinion drivers are more responsible for dangerous situations on our roads than bikers.
Would you rather all us bikers, who “risk” our lives on a daily basis just to spend a little more time with our families, wives and children, rather get in our cars and clog up the roads even more then they already are??? Catch a wake up man and stop being such an ignorant fool!!! It is people like you that give Cage drivers a Bad name with your bad attitude mean spiritted temper. I ride the Ben Schoeman daily on my bike and 90% of all the cage drivers leave enough space for us to pass without endangering our lives. Then you get the 10% that purposefully straddle the white line between the lanes or swerve infront of us when they see us coming etc etc..
Personally I hope I have the pleasure of meeting you one day so that I can slap some sense into your thick Skull…
Guys, guys, guys, all I said was that bikers have a generalised tendency to drive aggressively and irresponsibly but complain bitterly when accidents happen. There are good bikers and there are very bad bikers and just to clarify, I’m speaking about the bad bikers here not you passionate bunch who obviously drive perfectly all the time. Lets be honest, I can apply a similar classification to M3 drivers and they wouldn’t be so agro about it.
Seriously though, if anymore comments are as aggressive as these I’m just going to take them down as they offer no constructive feedback on an issue that many feel strongly about on both sides of the spectrum.
Perhaps you shouldn’t generalise like you had done in this post. Perhaps then bikers will be more interested in what you’re trying to say? and perhaps then you can have a proper conversation with bikers.
“There are good bikers and there are very bad bikers and just to clarify, I’m speaking about the bad bikers here ..”
Dude, where in your original post did you make THIS distinction? All you did was trash wholesale and without any qualification the ThinkBike campaign. What do you expect, do you think we are pussies sitting in M3s? Duh!
Instead of running defensively behind your ‘clarification’ – why don’t you answer the points made in response to your babble?
1. Lane splitting is perfectly legal; 2. sometimes we speed to get away from the likes of you; 3. the reason why most of us have accidents is because CAR drivers refuse to drive courteously, responsibly or with due caution as REQUIRED BY LAW.
We are certainly not being killed daily because we lane split, ride too fast or ride recklessly. We die daily on our roads because CAR DRIVERS refuse to drive as the LAW requires.
Of course you’ve had aggressive responses – YOU would also respond in like manner if 24-wheeled truck drivers blogged about driving over you!
Your self-righteousness, arrogance and ignorance is
truly staggering!
The BEST answer you have is “er.. I’m gonna take down your posts” ie. you refuse to take responsibility for your blog that threatens each and every bike on the road. And you still wonder why you had aggressive responses? Amazing!
Well let me apologise if my original post came across incorrectly, it was not my intention.
Craig, you’ve still missed the point: What I’m saying is that car drivers are idiots and bikers should be angry towards them BUT why do bikers have this attitude that they are always in the right.
Just to respond to your individual points:
1) I never said it was
2) Like when you drive at 100+KM/h on an open road?
3) I can’t comment on this as I would need something more specific.
How does this sound, I’ll take this post down and reword it so it takes into account my retelling of the story as well as everyone’s comments?
All I can say is man, that’s a lot of hate. Take the post down if you like, but I think leaving it up shows how people can so easily misunderstand, misinterpret, and be fueled by anger.
I did not see any of these comments you’ve been accused of making, from what I read this post is about how bikers need to be responsible first&foremost before they shift the blame. That’s it!
What I have learnt today is bikers are an angry&malicious group. Or at least, the ones that commented on this blog are. Also, that you should learn to rephrase things :p
Chill people, it’s only an opinion
Author: SaulK
Comment:
Well let me apologise if my original post came across incorrectly, it was not my intention.
Craig, you’ve still missed the point: What I’m saying is that car drivers are idiots and bikers should be angry towards them BUT why do bikers have this attitude that they are always in the right.
CRAIG Answers:
I’m still confused about WHICH bikers have ever said “we are ALWAYS right?” Where have ‘we’ said this?
If you read a number of the posts above where guys have said, “yes, you have a point that SOME bikers ride recklessly… BUT… only some…”
I am the first one to acknowledge that it is certainly the case that there are some reckless bikers. The percentage of reckless, irresponsible bikers is probably the same as for car drivers, based on the idea that whether a fool drives a truck, taxi, car or bike, they will be equally obnoxious no matter what vehicle they use.
My point is: which bikers, where, have said “we are always right?”
BTW, two of my friends were killed when a car swung out from behind a truck and hit both bikes… This is a VERY sensitive issue for me.
I recognise that SOME bikers are reckless, and that sometimes car drivers just make a mistake. I own 2 cars and two (German) bikes, but what I object to is being painted with the same “hooligan” brush as a reckless fool simply because I’m on a bike.
My sense is that all the girls/guys who posted on the TB forum were put out by your comment on lane splitting (which even if you didn’t actually say was illegal, still you implied that there was something wrong with doing something perfectly legal); your comments on speeding that implied ALL bikers speed recklessly is the second issue people objected to; and 3rdly, dissing the Think Bike campaign was just wrong. I’m a paid up TB member and I reckon this campaign has certainly helped me to be much more aware of drinking/ riding; being visible; safe riding; thanking other drivers who let me pass. We do at least AS MUCH work on bikers as we do on car drivers. We give up our time/ money to visit bike clubs to talk about safe, courteous and responsible riding.
I can see absolutely NO reason to diss this very worthwhile campaign. Feel free to surf over to http://www.thinkbike.co.za and if possible, tell me where this campaign 1. only preaches to car drivers; 2. holds that all car drivers are idiots and bikers are ALWAYS right? Yet, you felt free to diss a campaign that works so closely with bikers to change attitudes and behaviours.
I guess you’ve realised we are PASSIONATE!
Apology accepted.
CHEERS. Surf over sometimes… my forum nick is 747 (because I’m on a very slow and responsible BMW!!)
Hi Nadia,
How would you feel if every week, someone in a 24 wheel truck threatened the Arrive Alive campaign to run YOU over merely because you drive a VW Polo?
Actually, at Think Bike, we get letters (threats) every week from car drivers threatening to run over the next bike they see on the road.
Small wonder it pushes our buttons when yet another blogger mentions the “I’ll run over you” words…
I mentioned earlier there is a 17 year-old scooter rider dead because allegedly some taxi man felt he needed to do just that.
I too have both a son and a daughter who love riding with me. Do you blame me then, for getting angry when such threats affect my safety but more so my children’s safety?
We are not sharing an opinion on whether a movie is good or bad; we are dealing with our LIVES here. And whether any car driver wants to acknowledge it or not the truth is that more bikers are killed by car drivers/ etc breaking the law than by bikers breaking the law.
IT IS THE LAW TO LOOK BEFORE INDICATING TO CHANGE LANES; IT IS THE LAW TO INDICATE YOU INTEND CHANGING LANES; IT IS THE LAW TO CHECK THAT YOU CAN CHANGE LANES SAFELY; IT IS THE LAW THAT YOU CANNOT DRIVE WITH A CELL PHONE TO YOUR EAR.
Sadly, the original blog omits ANY mention of these kinds of violations, it merely dumps on any and every biker without qualification, and also on a safety campaign aimed at ALL road users.
You will notice that the blogger complains that bikers seem to think they are always right – yet, he does exactly the same – we are always in the wrong?
The one “opinion” is as bad as the other!
Subsequently, SaulK retracted some of his comments (above) and brought certain qualifications to his opinions. I am not asking for any more than that.
Please check your mirrors for me tomorrow. Thanks!
Craig,
Your comments, while filled with passion have so much anger and hate that I am struggling to stay neutral in my response. Like I said above, Saul needs to rephrase so as to not allow for misinterpretation, but he was not threatening you! And if he were, telling him you want to smack his head in&calling him hateful names makes you (plural) AS bad as the people you mention.
And he was not “dissing” Think Bike, he was saying that before all of that, people should THINK. Not in spite of it.
For your own interest, most of my family ride bikes. I believe most people on the road should not be there&at least five times a day I almost have an accident, noting how people do not know how to drive. In my opinion I am not pro-cars. I am anti irresponsibility, and shifting blame. Ontop of that I am very anti the way your (plural) passion has made you react. The responses have been very ugly today.
Nadia the response is ugly because to somoene who rides a bike this is a ugly statement
“when you learn how to drive we’ll stop running you over”
This has the tone of “until all bikers behave I will happily kill them”
now Saulk retracted the intention of that comment
What your saying makes it sound like you want people to go
“Oh great that wonderful person in his car wants to kill me.
How wonderful is that.
I wish more car drivers would like to kill me too”
I’m sorry death threats (and to a biker that is what that statement is) gets peoples hackles up and unfortunately you do get bad reactions from that.
Sorry if the replies is not to your loving rosy standard but to most bikers the original post is not exactly in a loving and caring tone either
To Saulk
thanks for clarifying your view
Dear Saulk I hear your complaints and concerns and yes as I agrre with some responses here, that maybe if you rephrased alot of things in your post and not generalise to ALL bikers the comments above would have been more nuetral and not so passionately.
Just to clear a few things up from a bike rider and a car rider I see more illegal movements and riding from cars than bikes. Be rather glad that that one bike that passes you dont take up more space so that it takes you longer to get home.
Secondly I am not sure why bikers always have to be compared to the Hells angels. Just one thing to take in cosideration is that your CEO (if you work for a company) may be the biker you want to kill. Yes like anything in our society is that you get 90% that obey the rules and do all right and then that 10% is the section that drags the whole name down.
I am not here to defend either party but I just think that the mind set needs to change from both sides … yes BOTH sides as we are trying our best as a campaign and law abiding citizens to get both parties to co-exist in the same space.
Last thing is please investigate and research thestatistics on Bike accidents. Most of the cases is that the driver of the car did not look or misjudged the bike and ran him over.
And stating that M3 drivers wont be so agro is because of the fact that they know its true. The bikers comments is not agro but more a concern for their and their fellow friends and families safety for the attitudes like your displaying in your post.
Paul
“U r obviously a very bored, ignorant little man with nothing better to do, than try to show off on a forum & probably drive a bmw or merc.Shame !!!” –> your words.
Whatever you may feel, what’s the point in resorting to name calling? There is no doubt here that this article uses wrong wording and I think we all agree that there has been a misunderstanding. I am not defending that. What I am saying is I find is disgusting at how people have resorted to hateful and angry comments. I felt sick reading how threatening people were and to be honest, my opinion of bikers has now changed after reading this.
You have become a hypocrite, threatening those who you believed to be threatening you, saying vicious and nasty things, because in your mind it is shocking to threaten.
Driving today I was on a 60km/hr residential road. I looked in my side mirror to see a bike trying to overtake. I looked at my speedometer realising I was already going 80, and slowed down. I then watched him overtake with oncoming cars on a 60 RESIDENTIAL road, the next 6 cars in front of me, who were all already speeding… I’m sorry, but after that, what can you really argue?
Hi Nadia, I really can’t see anything in my posts above that can be called “hate[ful]“. Please don’t get hysterical.
Actually, I would call anyone threatening “to run over [all] bikers” pretty hateful, wouldn’t you say?
You have made the point over and over that the people / bikers posting in response to such a blog “hateful” yet if you bothered to hold your emotions in check, you’d see that of the first 20 (that’s twenty) posts only 1 (that’s one) was threatening. Thereafter 2 more people suggested violence as a response to cars drivers trying to run us over on the road. That is 3 posts out of 36 (excluding SaulK’s replies).
This hardly constitutes the hateful bunch that you suppose all bikers now are. (Does this by any chance include the people in your own family you claim are bikers???)
I will repeat it here: 3/36 posts. Three out of thirty six.
Oh, one last thing, did you say you were breaking the law by going 80 (shock, horror!) in a 60 zone. Repeat after me; “I am a bad, bad girl.”
I guess you are exactly as evil as the biker who over took six cars doing 90, then? I suggest you hand yourself over to Wayne Minnaar tomorrow for a public flogging at 11:00am.
Uh, you DO have a sense of humour, I hope! This last bit is totally indulgent and frivolous, but if you are old enough to drive (do you have a license, dearie?) I suppose you are a big girl who can take an old guy’s ribbing.
Dear Craig, Get off your high horse. I backed down but you don’t have the decency to.
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